2010 WC: Czech Republic gets the Gold

jtlc,

The pan-European league might be a good thing somewhere down the road, but it is infeasible now. If there were a pan-European league, Russia would only be allowed to have two to four teams entered, and that wouldn't be enough to provide financial incentive for development of youth hockey throughout Russia. Whether it will survive, only time will tell, but right now, I think the KHL is the best way to go. The problem with Russian kids going to North America to play is that the vast majority end up in the AHL, and the AHL has been a graveyard for Russian careers. Kids who have enough hockey skill and talent to play in the NHL, but typically aren't hard hitters, end up playing in the AHL for two or three years before coming home. If a am an NHL GM, I'm going to think that it will be much easier for North American kids to adjust to the culture of the AHL, so I'm going to avoid drafting Russians. That makes sense.

72' summit series, tretiak with a new way of goaltending & kharlamov went past bill white like white was invisible. john. you can't deny a junior player's opportunity to play in the nhl. khl is a dinosaur philosophy. pan-european league with minimum level roster of national players is the way to grow. russia wouldn't have a problem for their teams. weaker teams would be relegated each year & top 2nd tier teams promoted. a decade at most for the 2 leagues to be battling for the best players ( north americans included).

jtlc,

Luckily for Tarasov, he had Kharlamov, Mikhailov, Maltsev, etc., so they didn't need to have him out there skating as well. I'm not one of those Russian hockey fans that hopes that a lot of Russian talent keeps flowing to the NHL, so the fewer Russians drafted the better. If they are all drafted in the 4th or 5th rounds. better yet! Some of it may involve an assessment that the level of Russian talent available isn't that good, and part of it may be fear that they will invest a lot in drafting a player who will later decide that he wants to play in the KHL. I'm not sure what the answer is. But the fact is that the Russian national team performance deteriorated badly once large numbers of Russians started going to the NHL, and the recent improvements at the World Championships coincide with a major strengthening of the Russian major leagues. As far as I can tell, sending Russian players to the NHL has hurt Russian international teams far more than it has helped them.

tarasov drafted from coaching soccer to coaching hockey, "Never Learned How To Skate", but apparently did learn how to write. 72' series, Soviets had a big platter of oranges in the middle of their dressing rooms, Canada had cases of beer. Canada Cup, change Soviets 'would' participate to 'could' participate. Prepare to be embarrased in a couple of weeks at the nhl draft. central scouting has only 3 russians ranked in the 1st round.

jtlc,

Anatoli Tarasov, who many call the Father of Russian hockey, wrote a book called "the Road to Olympus." Fred Shero, coach of the Philadelphia Flyer Stanley Cup champions from 1974-75, said in a speech that he had read Tarasov's book, from cover-to-cover, over 100 times, and that he learned new concepts about how to coach hockey every time he read it. He built the Soviet hockey machine at a time when there were literally no indoor ice rinks in the Soviet Union. How? Dyrland training. Canadian coaches write books about dryland training using concepts that were all developed by Tarasov.

Bobrov was just filling in for Tarasov during the 1972 series because Tarasov was in the doghouse with some Generals. Your opinion of him is definitely in the minority. Also, the IIHF never banned NHL players from the World Championships. The NHL's participation came on the the basis of a reciprocal agreement so that the Soviets would participate in the Canada Cup.

john.. i stand corrected on 86' moscow. salaries are much higher in the khl. nhl has had a strict salary cap in place since 2006, evens the playing field for all the teams, plus they can have more control over their budgets. north american great depression was 1929-39'. Canada went into a war economy in september 1939, no thanks to the ribbentrop-molotov brokered non-aggression pact. Soviet union had a 34 month 'delay of game' penalty. 4 olympics since 98' with nhl players, 2 gold. 72' & 76' olympic no show for Canada, result was iihf took notice & nhl was allowed at the world's, or do you prefer competing against bulgaria & poland. Soviet union players took 6 weeks of officer training, then played/practised full time. Not an option for north american players. they worked at real jobs full-time,played/practised part-time. Soviet coaching model in those years was tarasov who didn't know how to skate, conducted practises from the boards, absolutely pathetic.

jtlc

One more point about Russian hockey in the 1990's in comparison to the 2000's, by 2000, Russia had already begun a steady and steep period of economic growth and relative prosperity. That's why Russia could afford to resuscitate hockey and fund a league that pays salaries that are pretty close to the NHL. with much lower taxes. I believe this is a major factor for Russian hockey being on the rise lately!

jtlc,

Thanks for correcting me on Nagano, but my point was, Canada has won Olympic gold on North American soil, but not outside of North America, since NHL players have comprised their teams. Let me correct you - the Soviet Union won the World Championships in Moscow in 1986. Also, Canada's official position for not entering a hockey team in the 72 and 76 Olympics was that the Soviets had an unfair advantage because they played professionals (who made salaries equivalent to $400 a month). Obviously, the best of the NHL could only eke out a narrow win against the Soviet national team back then, so Canada's decision was correct.

In the 1990's, with the transition away from the Soviet Union, Russian hockey disintegrated along with the rest of society, with poverty rates three times the level of the Great Depression in North America, 1929-42. At the same time, the number of Russian players in the NHL was the highest ever(near 90, as compared to 28 this past season). But because NHL teams have never trained as hard or as systematically as the Soviets (I understand why that couldn't be done), the Russian international teams went into a steep decline in the 90's. Arguably one of the most talented Russian teams ever in terms of NHL superstars (Bure, Yashin) was the 2000 team that finished 11th in Moscow.

Since 2007, with fewer NHL players than ever, Russian teams have started to play well and win medals, twice Gold, in the Worlds. You can argue as to which role players should have been on the Canadian 1998 and 2006 teams, just like some Canadian fans were arguing on this site that Russia's big mistake was not selecting Alexei Kovalev for Vancouver. The Canada-Russia 2006 and 2010 games were single-game phenomena that will never be repeated, and predict nothing about the outcome of future games. I'll stand by my pick of Russia for Gold.

john... nhl players were only allowed in the Olympics since 1998 at Nagano. 2002 gold at Salt Lake City. 2006 Canada did the the Russian model of rewarding a few roster spots to players based on their past achievements and it exploded in their faces. that's one Olympics in Europe. Gold in Europe in 20',24',28',48' & 52'. Canada couldn't even be bothered to send a team to the 72' & 76' Olympics. The prize is always the Stanley Cup. European world championships in 94', 97',03',04' & 07' in Moscow. How many world championships or olympics has Russia won in Russia (none). A pity Sochi arena will only seat 12,000. Canada vs. Russia will be a barn burner.

jtlc,

Regardless of which Canadian players are available for the Sochi Olympics, Russia wins at home!
Remember, the two times that Canada played in the Olympics in Europe, things didn't go so well. In 2006, Canada's best got shut out by Russia, thereby failing to qualify for the Medal Round.

to john&igor.... you wouldn't be able to appreciate hockey if it was sitting on your faces. "so few good canadians" at the 2010 world championships. whitney 37, next oldest on the canuck roster was 26. del zotto,eberle,tavares,MYERS,STAMKOS, all 20. Kane& Duchene were all of 19. Hockey Canada is already planning for Sochi by getting their young stars on their roster. we get to watch all the best russian players regularly over the course of a season, present & past. 1997, lidstom paired with konstantinov whoooaa.

Well said, Igor,

I personally don't buy the argument that professional athletes who earn many millions should not be expected to work longer than eight months a year. And as you said, Ovechkin, Malkin, Datsyuk, and Gonchar all showed their courage and dedication to their country by showing up to play. Crosby has the right to go to the beach instead, if he chooses to do so, but please don't criticize the Russians who had the balls to show up! Because so few good Canadian players were willing to show up for Canada, the Canada game was one of the few easy wins for the Russian team.

prior to the collapse of the soviet union, the team was mostly moscow red army team players, a few exceptions like yashin,etc. when the professional players from other countries were allowed to compete, the monopoly was over. blaming foreigners for our team's failure doesn't happen here. in north america, we're the descendants of where those foreign players come from, including russia. bykov said today 2010 can be blamed on foreigners taking roster spots in the khl from russian players. bykov & john are both ridiculous, xenophobic hypocrites. 1) 87% of russian would love to visit Saskatchewan( i'm not from there, travelled through it, fantastically beautiful) 2) 12.9% will never,ever mix vodka with orange juice 3) 0.1% read Pravda. like Robert the Bruce & the spider....... get organized

when 4 or 5 players are waiting on the blueline,not smart to pass or skate through them. after the swedes had found a soviet min=submarine in their harbour, Don Cherry commented that they should have hid their mini-sub in a corner. Swedes don't go into corners. iginla went into the corner, chipped the puck out to crosby. irrelevant you turned down tickets to Wild games john..... every game there is sold out anyways. russians coming to north america aren't guaranteed an nhl roster spot. the determined ones will play in the AHL to develop, the weak & timid will end up in the khl. after watching emelin, i'm relieved he chose the 2nd
option.

jtlc,

You're a pretty astute trend-spotter! The number of Russians in the NHL has been declining steadily and steeply for the last 12 years. I think there were 28 Russians in the NHL this year, as opposed to more than 90 on NHL rosters in the late 1990's. The late 1990's was the era when the Russian's performance in international tournaments was at its very worst. In 2000, with the World Championships held in Russia, the Russian team consisting of Yashin, Bure and other superstars in their prime years, Russia finished 7th.

Many Russian fans, myself included, consider this a very positive trend. If you really want to see Russian hockey back at the top, it won't be from guys who play in the NHL. They don't play the style of distinctive Russian hockey in the NHL. I turn down Wild tickets because the NHL has too many teams and too little talent, and I fall asleep at dump and bump hockey. Russians are staying home to play in the KHL rather than serve a death sentence in the AHL, and that can only help Russian hockey. In the 1970's and 80's, Russian teams were outstanding because it was convenient to practice together as a national team during breaks in the schedule. By contrast, NHL players are only available in the off-season.

In regard to the Stanley Cup final, a few things about how it will be perceived South of the barren plains of Saskatchewan: (1) 87% of the American public thinks the Stanley Cup is for holding coffee; (2) of the remaining 13%. 12.9% will opt to watch re-runs of "Beavis and Butthead" instead; (3) of the .01% of the American population who would in any way care, they will be blaming Czechs, Slovaks, Swedes, Austrians and any other Europeans who could be scapegoated if their team loses.

chicago & philadelphia square off in the stanley cup final. 0 as in no russians on either's rosters. john... you can blow your "minnesota wild" theory out your bum. Lord stanley is guaranteed to visit the usa, canada, finland &sweden this year. depending which team hoists him up, maybe slovakia, france, austria, latvia, & czech republic as well. A well deserved ending for russia's l'annee horrible. Time for russia to have a national hockey summit to sort things out.

To me, it seems ridiculous to suggest that Ovechkin should be criticized because Russia didn't win Gold, when Sidney Crosby and many of his Olympic colleagues didn't even have the "heart" to show up. At least Ovechkin had the guts to lay it on the line. Crosby, on the other hand, got so tired getting stuffed by Montreal that he couldn't answer the bell to play for his country. The result - a Canadian team that went 3-4 and looked battered after losing their last three games in a row.

As for the seemingly general Canadian criticism that whenever their favorite team loses in the Stanley Cup, it must be that the Russians should be blamed for quitting, I wish they would back up their words. If you think that Malkin (remember, it was he, and not Crosby, who was the MVP in last year's Stanley Cup) doesn't show up in big games, tell Lemieux to have the guts to trade him for Corey Perry or Steve Stamkos, or better yet, place him on waivers. You wouldn't have to worry about my local team, the Minnesota Wild, picking him up. They don't hire Russians, and look how many Stanley Cups the Wild have won!

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Jeff,

I agree that Ovechkin's performance in the last three or four games was far below his potential, but the effort was clearly there. He worked and fought hard, but just couldn't get anything going. That happens to all the great players at times.

I have to give Ovechkin credit for making the effort to come to Germany to represent his country! Compare that to Sid the Kidlet Crosby, who begged off because the long season made him "tired." Playing with the intensity and punishing physical style that he does, I'm sure that Ovechkin was every bit as tired as Crosby was. He could have just as easily made the excuse that he was tired and wanted to go home to sleep off the long season.

Crosby is by far the most talented and skilled Canadian player since Mario Lemieux, so when he backed out, that made it easier for every other lesser player to do the same. Contrast that with the Russians, like Datsyuk, Malkin, Gonchar, Kovalchuk and Ovechkin, who were all tired, but who had the heart to tough out their tiredness and play for your country. Its easy to play in front of your countryment in Vancouver, but its tough to get on a plane and go to Germany for a two-week tournament. I give Ovechkin credit!

It is true that the Russian team failed to put together good passing combinations (not only yesterday, but on Thursday and Saturday as well), but that is to be expected when you throw together individual stars from different teams in different leagues over the course of a tournament that only lasts a couple of weeks. I think that the best that can be hoped for under such circumstances is brilliant individual play.

If the Russian Hockey Federation wants to create something on the order of what used to be regarded as "Russian hockey," I believe that that can only happen by organizing a real national team around KHL players who could gather together frequently and practice as a National team. They could add four or five of the best players from the NHL, depending on who is available, but the main part of the team could consist of a National team unit that practices and works together during breaks in the KHL season.